Tuesday, December 05, 2006

Sean Bell


Today in class we have discussed a recent shooting in Queens, NY. Why is this incident so volatile? What were the arguments O'Reilly and Sharpton tried to make on the show? Were they listening to each other? What resolution did O'Reilly and Sharpton come to if any? If you only read the NYTimes article presented in class today how might your view of the situation be different? What is the article leaving out?

12 comments:

W Brown said...

Excellent discussion today, your class impresses me more every time we meet. I especially liked how you are all starting to compare past classes with current issues. When Sam said,” It’s just more profiling...” I was so impressed. But I must admit Christine stole the entire class discussion today when she asked the question, “How come this never happens to three white guys in a car?” With this simple statement Christine changed the entire conversation. She reframed the argument. As “superfly” has said in previous posts, it was one of those “ah ha” moments.

I thank you all for being such active participants in the discussions. This class because of the deep conversation and your commitment to posting online is easily of the the highlights of my teaching career so far.

W Brown said...

On a side note...Please read the last comment on Sahiba's Visit...she responeded to all of you who posted.

nyshee............ said...

i can agree to what christne in class because i live iin da st. albans area and i see cops around the blocks when i come u dont even know if it's a good thing or a bad thing around the area because at times the 5-0 can see me walking and start questiong me on "where im going" or where are you coming from" stuff like that and one of my good friends was friends with mr. bell and i know the person is having a bad time at this moment and trying to figure why would the police fire out 50 shot? what was the point in all of that? that doesnt make any good sense to me. and a good thumbs up to mr shapton
on da bill oreily show because if that was me i would me screaming at the top of my lugs at this guy. this shooting can be a race thing because who do you know thats white thats been shoot 50 times and why is it always not thinking before action? why is that? police officers need some more training because it seems like they dont know what they doing at all

Edwin G said...

On November 25th policeman heard that some
one had a gun outside a Jamaica strip club, the police were scared. One cop shot 50 shots into a car. He was wrong that is a lot of shots. No one was really sure if anyone had a gun. One man was killed and two others got shot. Everyone said it was because the men were black. I think people acted too fast more things have to be looked at. It will take a long time. I feel bad for everyone, it was a bad thing a lot of mistakes.

christine mullen said...

I feel the incident was so volatile because for some reason everyone has this image in their heads that black males are automatically a threat. While watching the video with O'Reilly and Sharpton I sort of seen the arguments. What I mean by that is to me it seem like O'Reilly was fighting a battle he knows nothing about. The reason I say that is because using the fact that crime rate has gone down and the facts that police officers risk their lives everyday. Might I add that risking your life everyday is apart of the job that these officers willingly signed up for? I understood the arguments coming from sharpton. Sharpton brought up the fact that this is a race issue. Which everyone is trying to keep the blind folds on for this because now it’s a bunch of New York’s finest on the line. I felt that the two men were listening to one another but also trying to get their points across. I personally felt that O'Reilly just wanted to have a screaming match even though in class I said I would have walked out I am proud that he didn’t. sharpton did exactly what he should have fight for his argument to be heard and understood. They ended with no resolution because even though sharpton had him in a corner and O'Reilly started to agree. He wasn’t mature enough not to get his last slick comment in there. So it was like he agreed half way but still felt like it was a race issue. I don’t know who told O'Reilly that blacks couldn’t dislike other blacks, but they misinformed him. There are plenty of people who treat their race the worst. So that is absolutely false. The last thing I remember being said in the class was would sharpton be up their if it was white males. You know what I say to that I don’t feel they would need him because I feel if that were white males out there the world would have been on their side. Its like if your blacks you don’t automatically get that supportive help from the world. We work for that and even though we have lots of people outside our race getting involved now it was not always like that. We are working hard to finally get that automatic help but things like this push us back down to nothing.

shanicca conyers said...

where should I start because I felt as if I voiced my opinion about this situation in class... well I should start on how I feel... just like everyone else I feel that 50 shots were outrageous. I send my condolences to his family (not like they will read this but…)
now with the situation just as we all know there are good cops and there are bad cops and when cops know they are in the wrong or they are going down for what they done they will do anything to make it better for them… such as when they said there was a “fourth guy” I feel that they made up this guy so they won’t look as bad if there wasn’t a “fourth guy.” Christine did make a point but I still fail to see it as a racism matter. I feel it was more on police brutality. Police officers take things above the line.

vishnell said...

Before our discussion I never saw the police point of view of what happened. I thought simply the police were wrong for killing an innocent man. After Mr. Brown explaining where the cops could have been coming from to do what they did it sort of made more sense to me. I honestly believe people are quick to judge the cops for what has happened. Don’t get me wrong I don’t think it justifies what they did it jus gives me a different perspective of what happened the night Sean Bells life was taken. I honestly do think the cops jus reacted to the situation quick. They were told Sean Bell and his friends had a gun so like Mr. Brown said in order to protect your own life you shoot at a man until he is down which is what the cops did.

Something that was really stressed in class today was can someone be racist to their own kind. A black cop can be quick to judge his own kind. For example if you are in a neighborhood that has a high rate of robbery and a cop just found out something was stolen. There is a white man and a black man, who would he be quick to assume first? The society we live in is very judgmental and racist on its own. No matter what I honestly feel everybody either does or says something racist at some time. Well this all ties in because people question the death of Sean Bells death being racist or not. Especially when we watched the video clip of O'Reilly and Sharpton their whole discussion was based on race. O’Reily didn’t believe that a black man can be racist towards another black man which almost the whole class disagreed with.

The last question we were asked is if the NYTimes article that was given in class the only article we read how might our view of the situation be different and what is the article leaving out. The first thing Mr.Brown asked after reading the article in class is “what is this article leaving out”? So I knew we weere going to have most of our discussion on race. A lot of people might not even think of race as a issue. Like dicussed in class how many times do we really hear about situations like this happen to a white male?

~* Corrie R *~ said...

The discussion we had in class about the shooting of Sean Bell went well, mainly because there was a mixture of opinions and also because there are a lot of questions that still need to be answered about what actually went on that night. But I have to say I agree with Christine with every point she said dealing with the issues. When we watched the interview with Sharpton and O’ Reilly there were a couple of comments said that I questioned. Like for one when O’ Reilly said this isn’t a race issue. Race has to with everything. You can tell race has to do with the shooting because even in the article we read in class the author failed to mention the race of the victims or the cops and to get the background of the story you need to know the race of the cops and victims. You can tell that this is also a race issue because as someone said in class if this was three white guys in a car they would’ve never gotten shot. In fact this would’ve never happened in a white neighborhood. The only reason they shot the guys like that is because they were black and as soon as they see a black man they think danger. Even black cops see a black man and think danger. I could say this because I live in a predominate black neighborhood and I seen the cops harass my own brother. This case reminds me to much of the Amadou Diallo case who got shot 19 times out of 41 bullets for pulling out a wallet. This case also reminds me of how animal’s lives are more important than the black community. I can say this because you have animals running around in back yards in New Jersey, breaking into peoples houses and they don’t get shot 51 times, in fact they use an tranquilizer gun. Another thing I questioned that O’ Reilly said was something about how can black cops be racist of their own kind. Any body can be racist to their own kind. I feel that black cops think they have to prove something to white cops and the black people. I think that black cops feel that they have to do what white cops do to prove that they can do it too, but to the black people they feel like they are superior and are in charge. Black cops are tougher and rougher with black people than white people. This is true because black cops are always portrayed that way in movies and in books. I think the interview with Sharpton and O’ Reilly went well even though O’ Reilly had to add his two cents in. They were listening to each other and Sharpton got his opinions across. I’m glad Sharpton stayed there and took the yelling and screaming from O’ Reilly because the black community needs the support from someone. Back to what someone said about three white males getting shot (which would never happen) and would Sharpton be there. Sharpton wouldn’t be there because there would have way louder voices like the president to voice there opinion and there would be more sympathy towards them.

Josh C said...

I feel that this incident is unjust. i feel that it was completely unnecessary for the victims to be shot at, considering the fact that none of them were armed and posed no threat. They worst thing is that Sean Bell was lost at such a groundbreaking point in his life, as his engagement to be married. I feel that the cops need to step forward and own up to the mistake that they have made and accpet responsibility for their actions. I hope the family of Sean Bell is granted the justice they are so desperately seeking and the police are punished for their acts of brutality.

shanicca conyers said...

may i add that when watching the news the other day... they got some new news... that after the whole shooting the police officers had to do a report and in their report nothing was metion about the "fourth guy" there for to me... like i said before there was NEVER a "fourth guy" and the police put the mystory man in their so they won't look as bad....

~RitaMarie~ said...

In a situation such as this I do believe that whether it was a race issue or not, it is bound to turn into one because there were two sides. Sean Bell, an African American male and then Caucasian police officers. I agree with what Christine and Josh said in that common sense would tell anyone that NO ONE needs to be shot 50 times for someone to know that he is dead. And legally if the police suspected the man of having a gun, and shot in an effort of "self-defense" they are still accountable in that they 1) are trained to only fire when fired 2) shot the person once in the leg so that the person is unable to move and therefore they can carry out their duties. Second of all, it is 4 in the morning. The witnesses around (if any) were I’m sure not very reliable sources. Knowing that this was a factor and that there were no other accredited witnesses, and the man was shot 50 times it is easy to see that this is in fact more of an issue than the police are willing to admit. The officers should own up to the motives of what happened and the pain that they are causing the victim’s family.

stephanie said...

Mr. Brown...i thought i commented on this one and it didnt come up.?